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S1 EP51 | Making Quick Decisions, Not Perfect Decisions with Paul Hanson

Show Notes:

Focus Discussion of the Week:

Do you take action when needed? Do you admit when you’re wrong? Do you take ownership of your role? As a strong business leader, these are key questions to consider. Paul Hanson from EPCON Franchising discusses why “Making Quick Decisions, Not Perfect Decisions” is vital to navigating your business through any economy or situation, and why being right all the time doesn’t necessarily lead to success.


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Two thought leaders come together to explore all things sales and marketing from their unique perspectives. Each week, Mollie Elkman, Matt Riley, and others from Group Two dive into a focus discussion to talk about the latest trends, changes, and best practices.

[00:00:00] Paul: How quickly then do you reevaluate a decision that you made and quickly make another decision if it’s warranted? So in the example of this crazy year, March 12th hits here in Ohio, the schools closed restaurants start to close. It would have been unwise to make any decisions that day that would permanently affect your business.

but be very clear in the coming days that. Okay. We really need to change the way that we market and sell our houses. So how do we do that? So if you were willing to hold off on March 12th, get some more information, but then say March 16th or 17, say, okay, we’re full go. We need to have some solutions ready, because this is the reality that we’re going to face for the next several months.

[00:01:00] Matt: Hi, and welcome to building perspective with Matt Riley and Mollie Elkman, but we’re here to bring

Mollie: value to you and your team by exploring all things, sales and marketing related

Matt: all from different perspectives. All right. And welcome back to another week. Glee episode of building perspective. And this week we have an incredibly special guest.

We have. Paul Hanson president con franchising with us today. So Paul, welcome to the show.

Paul: Thank you, Matt. Thank you, Mollie.

Mollie: We’re so happy to have you here. I have, I’ve known you for a long time and so I was very happy to hear your name and to connect with you again. why don’t you go ahead and share a little bit about yourself and what you’re doing?

Paul: Well, I’ve been in the home building industry, my entire career. started in 2003, right out of college with a national builder and started at the bottom rungs of the construction teams, [00:02:00] weeping houses and doing all the dirty work. but then was able to rise through the ranks and run a site of my own.

Then start taking a role in purchasing, Spend some time in sales. And then, when that company entered the West Florida market in Tampa, I was able to go there and, oversee the entire construction operations for the Tampa Bay area. five years ago, I was called by a recruiter who wanted to interview me for a position as a vice president at a.

Home-building franchise, which, my first question was what’s a home-building franchise because at the time I didn’t know, that was such a thing. but I spent a couple of years with them and, and first oversaw the, the Florida market for them. And, I’m from the Midwest. So they moved me back to the Midwest and had me set up an operation there when they, wanted to start finding franchise partners, in the Midwest.

And then I was about two years ago that my current company. Up con, approached me about, overseeing their entire franchising operations. So, settle back [00:03:00] into Columbus, Ohio. And I’ve been doing that now for two years.

Mollie: So you, you said your first question was what is a franchise home builder. So why don’t you explain a little bit about just what that means to oversee the franchises?

Paul: Sure. Well, yeah, so I’d been in the industry for 12 years with a very large builder and had been in different markets, but I just never heard of this concept before. And as I learned about it, it was, it was very interesting to me and I was excited to take that position and get. Exposed to that part of the industry.

And so what we do, and then what that company did is we find, or maybe even in some cases, regional builders, that lack the systems and tools of a big builder, and we give them those resources so they can scale and grow and increase their profitability in their markets. So one of the things we like to say is we, we give small builders, big builder tools, and that’s really the essence of what a home building franchise does.

Mollie: I love that. So there [00:04:00] could be a lot of small regional builders or local regional builders who are at con builders, but Epcot isn’t necessarily the name of that company. They have their own building company name.

Paul: Yes. It varies. If it’s a, a builder that’s smaller or maybe even new to the industry entirely, we do have some land developers.

And as, as an example, that. Want to diversify into home building. They will go to market as up con communities. And that is an option for them. And it’s a good option because we have a number of marketing resources that they can then take and adapt without developing their own. but for larger builders and we have several of these regional builders that, because we’re, we’re very specific in what we do.

We do 55 plus housing. So as an example, we have a builder in Nebraska that. Did 300 homes a year when they came to us, but they were all military housing or first time buyer or move up housing and they didn’t have a 55 plus segment in their business. So it was very attractive to them to adopt what we do and not have to invent their own product [00:05:00] line, their own sales process, their own marketing materials.

And so in markets like that, they do go to market as their existing trade name because it’s well known there. And then they’ll, co-brand where they’ll show. their logo, but then also our logo, which gives them the opportunity to tell the story of what F-com communities is and why they decided to bring it to their market.

Matt: Yeah, I love it. And, and it works really, really well. I know we have multiple, builder partners that we work with that are part of that exact scenario that, that you were just talking about where, you know, they can either operate under repcon or they can operate under their, their own. Their own builder name and, and utilize the up con plans and tools.

So, anyway, I, I think it works great and I know that, the builders that we work with are incredibly happy to be a part of that. But, and so. Kind of diving in, as we talk about, you know, I loved your saying Paul, about how you said, you know, we give small builders, essentially big [00:06:00] builder tools. and part of that tool box, is, is really that decision making process.

And so one of the things that I was really interested in chatting with you about today was. The importance of making really quick decisions in lieu of perfect decisions. and, Mollie and I talk about that all the time. You know, when we were chatting kind of, I guess, quote unquote, backstage, we were talking about that w we share that similar passion and, and so, really wanted to dive into that topic today.

And, and, and for you specifically, What does, what does that mean for you? Making quick decisions, not perfect decisions? Like how does that resonate with you?

Paul: It’s it’s certainly something that I’m known for around the office almost to the point that it’s a running joke because it’s in contrast to many people in the home building industry in general.

you think about the fact that we in many ways still build houses, right? The same way that we [00:07:00] did many, many years ago. And, even up until recently, we marketed homes the same way we always had, up until recently. And. So for me, I think there’s three things that I like to keep in my mindset, which helped me make good decisions quickly, as opposed to trying to make perfect ones that take too long.

And first of those three things is having a bias towards action and. This is certainly something that I learned, being with a national builder in a very good national builder at that. while I wasn’t given the opportunity to make significant decisions, especially early on in my career when I was a project manager on the construction side.

but I was expected to carry them out under high expectations. So there were a number of just beneath the surface decisions that I had to make quickly to succeed, to make the overall. Big decisions happen or the big initiatives happen. And so that could be making quick decisions on a foundation repair or [00:08:00] on scheduling concerns and things like that.

So having that bias towards action really makes the difference for me in wanting to move things quickly and do it well, I’m not talking about being careless or anything like that, but. Trusting yourself and we’ll get into kind of how you do it in a little bit. but it’s really key to making sure that you’re, you’re moving quickly and having that bias towards action.

I think a second thing is having ownership of your role, and this is a very difficult thing for a manager to coach. but I also learned this being with a national builder that, I was on my own at a job site there wasn’t somebody looking over my shoulder all the time. And so I knew pretty quickly if I wanted to be successful there.

I needed to identify my own ways to contribute and prove my worth. And as a manager now, I really love identifying that point at which I see new employees take that sense of ownership and start to make the decisions on their own and start to really, truly have buy in to their [00:09:00] results and what they’re doing in their jobs.

And I would say the last thing probably the most important is just a willingness to be wrong at times. I think a lot of leaders avoid tough decisions because they want to avoid the possibility of vulnerability, of being wrong, and then having to admit to the team that they’re wrong. But that’s, that’s really, and I think in our business, we’re fortunate that most failures are either fixable or insignificant.

And I think in some cases even provide the opportunity for you to build trust with your employees or your customers. One example, and this is a minor one, but I think early in my career, There was a rainy day and I kind of rolled the dice on pouring a driveway and it didn’t turn out great to the average.

I, it probably would have been just fine, but, it was difficult homeowner on this particular job. And so before he even showed up to criticize it, I had the flat workers began to tear it out and he actually showed up that day [00:10:00] as they were tearing it out and was, was truly impressed. Not, not that I had rolled the dice or, or made the mistake there, but truly impressed that I was willing to admit that I had.

something that didn’t prove, turn out to be the best course of action, but was willing to correct it and make it right for him.

Matt: and I, and we can unpack all of those, but I love that because that willingness to be wrong really as something that, like you said, it. It’s going to help gain, buy in to those around you.

Right. It’s going to help, you know, in that scenario it was the customer. They, they didn’t have to speak up. They saw it, you saw something wasn’t right. So he needed to fix it. And so I think that that’s a huge. Part of being a leader, whether, you know, leading your company, leading you’re leading your customers.

I think those are, I think those are really good, really great points. So the three main points bias towards action ownership, ownership of your role and willingness to be wrong. Let’s [00:11:00] let’s unpack each one of those three things a little bit and kind of dive in a little deeper. So let’s start at the top.

So bias towards action for you. What, what does bias towards action

Paul: look like? I think it means not just having a bias towards action in your typical role at work or in, in your role in managing a team, if that’s where you’re at, but it’s a bias towards action in improving what you see in your organization, in what you’re doing on a daily basis.

So not just settling, a lot of people would be content to settle into their, their role and. Not question how things are being done or how they’re servicing their customers. But the people that truly improve their organization are able to quickly identify areas, opportunity areas, and then move towards action to correct them and make the quick decisions along the way to bring it about effectively.

[00:12:00] Matt: Yeah. And I think that bias towards action obviously ties right into, making quick decisions, not perfect decisions, for you bias towards action is all right. We’re gonna, we’re gonna evaluate it. We’re gonna move quickly. But. How quickly do you change? Course, if you need to, if you see again, we’re going to, we’re going to unpack a little bit of all of it, but I think they tie in together, but you know, that bias towards action.

You make a decision. You, you, you know, you see, you see what needs to be done. You, you have a bias towards action. You’re willing to be wrong and you own your role. how quickly do you. Look at that decision and say, okay, need to need to change course here. What, what does that, what does that look like for

Paul: you?

Well, I don’t have a, a simple recipe for that and it obviously varies by how significant the decision is and how many people are impacted by making a change. But I think it, it, it does go back to that willingness to be wrong. And just [00:13:00] identifying from the beginning that you can’t be too bought into your own ideas or your own decisions that if you implement something and.

You immediately see it’s not as effective as you wanted or. More importantly, if you’re getting feedback from your team, that they see it as a problem, then you need to be open very quickly. And I would say within a couple of weeks to change course and identify a new opportunity and maybe even just tweak what you’re already doing.

You don’t necessarily have to go back to the drawing board, but just be ready to make some tweaks and adjust along the way instead of being so committed to any decision that you made or any idea that you might have had, avoid the temptation to take offense when something that you’ve. Decided on isn’t working.

Mollie: I love this topic because everyone who’s listening makes tons of decisions every single day, no matter what position you’re in, you’re making decisions. And it makes me think about when my dad and my stepmom bought a new home. I am not even joking. They were [00:14:00] trying to pick out the paint color and my stepmom, who is the best.

I love her. She had. 15 shades of white paint samples up on the wall. And I’m not even joking as the months went by, we weave, it became kind of funny, but when you look at it, you think like just make a freaking decision. And I think that we can all relate to that feeling of panic, of making the wrong decision.

Obviously, things that are more important than a paint color, but when it, when it. Stops you from moving forward and, you know, just, you know, doing the best work that you can possibly do. That’s where it becomes a problem. And I think that one. One, key part of success is this ability to just make decisions and go with them.

And I, I really think that our audience can all learn from that. And today, think about one decision that [00:15:00] you’re hesitating on and just go. Pick it and go and move forward. And if you can take a second and identify something that you’re kind of holding back on and use this, use this conversation to empower you to make a decision.

Paul: Yes, Mollie and I, I think that that what you’re describing is just. I always like to say a confused mind cannot make a decision. And so I think it’s very important to when you’re considering some alternatives, limit yourself to the number of alternatives that you’re considering, because I can remember a time at my last last company, when somebody put together a spreadsheet of 10 different options of how we could structure our revenue model.

And it was just insane because you could pick apart every single one. but if we were limited down to two or three options that were all very good and we could build arguments pretty easily, that would have been a lot easier to make a decision. And at the end of the day in, in that scenario, We never made a decision because nobody could ever agree upon which [00:16:00] of the 10 options was actually best.

Mollie: Yeah. It’s the same reason why builders production builders don’t want to give too many options when it comes to options and upgrades, because making those decisions, you want to make the decisions. Easier not harder and more complicated. So I think there’s definitely like this human factor of, you know, keeping it simple.

And that really ties into marketing because we use that same thought process when we are marketing any product, any community, the more simple you can keep it, the quicker you’re going to get to the right answer.

Matt: Yeah. I mean, it’s the old saying, like death by choice, right? I mean, w we’re talking about, you know, the, this particular episode is from a business perspective with home builders, but all of this plays a factor, a factor into how we interact with our own, with our own customers as well, because when you’re presented like Paul, like you [00:17:00] just said there, you know, A dozen ways to splice up your, you know, your, your revenue model, your, you know, you can’t make that decision.

There’s so many options in front of you and, and, and running any company for that matter. But we’re obviously we’re talking about home building. What we do is make decisions every day. And I don’t think that we should ever lose sight of that. When it comes to our buyers as well, because guess what?

They’re making decisions all day as well. And they’re fatigued when they get to us, they’ve already worked a full work week, just like we have or where we are in our work week. And they’ve already made all their decisions for the day. I mean, I don’t know the numbers. I forget the numbers off the top of my head, but like, Sheer decision making and willpower, the later you get into the day is, you know, the, the, the worst off your decisions are going to be, and which is why you should make the most important decisions up front in the beginning of the day.

But I think this always translates into how can we make the, [00:18:00] you know, the process easier for our customers? How can we make the decision making process, not feel as, Like this massive tsunami coming on to them. and those of us who can figure that out and make it easy for our buyers, are, are gonna reap those rewards.

And I think if we can make it easy for our buyers, we can also make it easier for ourselves. Do you agree?

Paul: I do. And I think now I’m in a different role as running a home building franchise and I’m selling a different product to people than I was when I was selling homes. But the same principle applies when I came here.

The agreement terms that we had were, were very confusing and there were a number of different fees that kicked in at different times. And then there were a corresponding credits that applied, if you did certain things and. I remember hearing a story about one, one of my salespeople had the meeting with a prospect and he said, how do you ever sell one of these things after explaining the way it worked to him?

So [00:19:00] an immediate focus of mine was to really simplify that and make it very straightforward. And we raised some of the fees, but we made it much simpler and eliminated the credits and, made it much more easier to understand than, than it had been in the past.

Matt: Yeah, absolutely. Okay. All right. So your second bullet of making quick decisions, not perfect ones was owner, you know, we hit on bias towards action.

The second one was ownership of your role and that’s, that can be, you know, any role within the organization. but let’s, let’s dive into some detail and unpack that one a little bit. So. Share a little bit about what you mean when you say ownership of your role.

Paul: What it means to me is that you don’t just care about how you do your job.

At this point, you care about how you can make your job even better, how you can improve what you’re doing. And in our case, the [00:20:00] service that you’re providing to our builders. And I mentioned earlier, I always love identifying that point at which that light just clicks on with people where they start coming to me with ideas of what they’re going to do to make things better instead of.

Me providing direction to them as I typically do early in the process. And in some cases it’s even happened earlier than, than I expected. I, we recently started a position, earlier this year and I wanted to give her a little bit of time to acclimate in the role and start to learn what the needs are within the system before I started to give her too heavy of direction.

but then within about two months, she actually came to me. With an idea that I had that I just didn’t think she was ready to run with yet. So it was really exciting to see that. And, that, that’s a big thing for me to get into when I’m interviewing people to get a sense of how they’ve approached their jobs in the past and have them provide examples of what they’ve done to make their organization better and not just check the boxes on their job [00:21:00] description.

Mollie: Do you think there’s anything that really helps guide people towards owning their role earlier? I know, I know exactly what you mean by that like moment where it clicks, but I’m curious if that, if you think that comes down more to like personality and attitude, or if there’s something you can do to guide that,

Paul: I do think personality is a big part of it.

And we talk a lot about intrinsic motivation and you certainly need to find people. That are going to have that because that’s, I don’t think that’s very coachable, but you can make a big difference just in terms of the culture that you set and the expectations that you set. And from the beginning, telling them that I want you to own this.

Area of our services. And I want you to come to me with ways that we’re going to make it better and maybe start them off with somebody he is that you have, but put it on them to come back, spend 60 days position or so, and then come back to you with their best ideas to improve what you’re providing [00:22:00] to your buyers.

Mollie: Because we do. I think sometimes we think like a leader is someone who naturally emerges among the group, but it, but what you’re saying, I, you know, it makes me think of someone here in particular group two, who I did that with them. And I said, okay, you own this and this person just completely thrived and became such a leader because she knew that she owned this.

Specific role. And I think that actually saying it out loud, does, does help. people become leaders that they don’t even necessarily realize they can be.

Paul: I agree. And one can certainly argue that I don’t have the right mentality on this, but I. I don’t consider myself to be a very creative or ideas type of person.

What I am good at is identifying and good ideas and challenging people to come to me with them and then implementing those. And [00:23:00] I think you’re going to learn at least in my experience, way more from your people, especially if you’re going into a new situation where there’s an existing group of people that have been doing their jobs for awhile.

You’re going to get there a lot faster if you go to them and ask them, okay, what do we need to do? And then identifying the ones that are workable and you think are going to have the most, the best effect on your organization and then setting them loose to accomplish it. Yeah. And

Mollie: it sounds like that leads perfectly into the next one, which is the ability to be wrong.

Paul: It is. And I think I will a lot to Bernay Brown on this, just having the right mentality about vulnerability and admitting when you fail or fall. but for me, I, I make a point to tell all my people, too. I want you to disagree with me when I’m wrong. It’s your job to tell me when I have something wrong.

And then I’m also very candid with them when I get things wrong. And I admit it to the group and vulnerability is not. [00:24:00] Telling everybody that you don’t know what you’re doing, or even giving people that impression, but it’s giving them a sense that you’re self aware enough to know that you’re not perfect.

You’re not going to get it right every time, but that together we are going to get it right at the end of the day.

Mollie: I love that because it definitely creates a team atmosphere. I always joke. I mean, I love being wrong. I love when people know something that I don’t know, because it’s only gonna make you continue to get better as an individual. So I’m, I’m wrong or fail at least once every day.

Matt: W w well, and I think too, you know, the willingness to be wrong.

And I think to add on to that is. Do it at speed, right? Like how quickly can we identify that we’re wrong or I’m wrong, or, you know, and everyone being okay with being wrong and making, you know, having an idea, that’s not the, you know, it ends up being, not the best idea or [00:25:00] find out that, Hey, we should be doing something a little differently.

The quicker we can find that out. The better off we are.

Paul: That’s true. And we have a, a consultant on our team who works with our builders on finding land. And it’s, it’s always eye opening when he meets with them the first time. And he says, look, the point of my job is to get you to a no as quickly as possible.

So you can eventually find a yes for your first site. And I think that goes with most decisions that we make in business, that you’re going to have a lot of nos and you want to get to those as quickly as possible. So you can ultimately find the yes.


Matt: w w without a doubt. so, all right, so we take w we’re taking these three points, and so I wanna kind of wrap these up into Some examples of some things that I know that we’ve seen, especially in the year that we’ve had in 2020, where, when the pandemic hit, we had no idea. We had no idea what we were going to [00:26:00] actually see what this thing was going to actually look like.

and, and I think that there are. There were two extremes of this making decisions, not perfect decisions. One is this knee jerk reaction decision and the other is paralysis by analysis. Right. and so when, when COBIT hit, you know, you had the two opposite ends of the spectrum with, with some home builders, one, the knee jerk reaction was let’s.

We got to shut it down, like stop it all. We go into instant preservation mode because we just have no idea what’s coming. And we, you know, we’ve got to protect the mothership at all costs. you know, and on the opposite end of that spectrum, it was absolutely freezing of not knowing this. Knee shaking, not knowing what to do and can’t make any decision at all.

And so sometimes I feel like [00:27:00] me personally, and you can get into the willingness to be wrong, but feel free to disagree with me. But sometimes I think making the decision to temporarily not make a decision. Is the decision, right? And it’s the right decision to kind of gather all the facts to figure out what you think is the best course of action to move forward.

And I think the ones that, that really have come out. Substantially more if that’s correct. That’s, that’s improper grammar, on top, and have seen the most impactful results through all this. We’re the ones that said, okay, we’re not gonna pump the brakes just yet. We’re not going to hit the gas either just yet.

Let’s figure out where we are. Let’s give this 30 days to figure out what the heck’s we are actually going to see before we start making any money.

Paul: I would agree with that. And I think this ties into our discussion about how quickly then. Do you reevaluate a decision that you made and quickly make another [00:28:00] decision if it’s warranted?

So in the example of this crazy year, March 12th hits here in Ohio, the schools close restaurants start to close. It would have been unwise too. You make any decisions that day that would permanently affect your business. but it became very clear in the coming days that, okay, we really need to change the way that we market and sell our houses.

So how do we do that? So if you were willing to. Hold off on March 12th, get some more information, but then say March 16th or 17th and say, okay, we’re full go. We need to have some solutions ready, because this is the reality that we’re going to face for the next several months.

Mollie: It’s really, really interesting because what we did was a little different.

So I actually closed down. I didn’t close down group two, but I had everyone working from home before March 12th. So before the shutdown and before school closed, earlier that week, the decisions have everyone worked from home and also I pulled my kids out of [00:29:00] school. So, you know, I am definitely someone who is extremely decisive and we’re also in an urban market.

So I think that probably changed our decision making process a bit. But it’s just interesting to see like two very two different approaches.

Matt: Yeah, absolutely. I think that, What that I think what we did. And we met in Mali, we actually saw builders, builder partners that we work with doing things similar that were in other markets. You know, we work with, some builders up in Washington state area where this COVID really, really started and.

You know, we started maneuvering with them early on, which was, which was why we were able to, you know, cause we were actually had it figured out a little bit sooner up there, which is why we were able to make quicker decisions and help our builders make quicker decisions as it, as essentially the, the invisible line started working its way across [00:30:00] the country.

so I, I agree that that’s, that becomes something that, It is interesting how, how, how it changes, you know, from company to company.

Paul: Yeah. And I think if you were to summarize this whole discussion, this is about how can you be most adaptable in your business? And so that’s going to vary based on your situation and where you are, Mollie in an urban setting, it’s, it’s entirely different than what the calculus was here and more of a suburban setting and where we are.


Mollie: I think, I think that, what you just said about being adaptable, I think when it comes to your team for your customers, that ability to be adaptable, builds trust, and that’s a really hard thing to build. And when you were able to, adjust and just like your example earlier about pulling up that driveway, it just shows a level of integrity and.

That you want to get it right. And you better believe I know that I don’t [00:31:00] know this guy, but I am sure he told a ton of people how amazing and how detail oriented, you know, the builder is in order to pull up a driveway that’s down to make it perfect. So I think that trust factor is a key to this conversation.

Paul: Yeah. The other half of that story is that was the situation. This is Oh six. So the company had just. It’s been a big reduction. And I showed up on a job site that was in disarray and he was one of the customers at the time. And at the time he was faxing a list of items every day that he noticed on the job, the day that he came out and saw me tearing up that driveway before he saw it.

I didn’t hear from him again after that.

Mollie: I mean, that’s a perfect success story.

Matt: Ah, I see that. And one of the things in, in my previous life, home builder, One of the things we always talked about was what you know, on, on the house, you’re the house you’re building. if you make the [00:32:00] buyer find the mistake they are going to, you’re going to get lit up the rest of the process, right?

When you go do that final walkthrough, there’s going to be 450 pieces of blue tape in that house, you know, on that, on that punch walk. because they don’t feel like. You’re the one looking for stuff, they feel like you’re the one, actually just trying to cover it up so you can get to it, closing a where it’s a totally different interaction or relationship.

It’s a totally different closing when you’ve taken the initiative to say, you know what, this isn’t right. Whether that’s something big is ripping out a driveway and reporting it. Cause that obviously it’s not cheap or whether it’s something to say, you know what, the spot on this wall or. The the, this section of the tiles job or the floor or whatever, it may be just isn’t right.

It doesn’t meet our standards. It’s not how I would want to take my home, or it’s [00:33:00] not what I would want to give to one of my family members when that happens in, especially when the buyer hasn’t noticed it yet. And I think the buyer slash team member that is interchangeable in this, you know, we’re using the buyer in the home building.

Right. You know, building the home is, as the, as the narrative here. But I think that, that you can insert, you know, employee team member of your own company, because when they feel whenever that. Third party, whenever that other person feels the trust that, wow, this person’s really looking out for me.

They’re looking to get it right. not just. You know, get one over on somebody. I think that, that, that relationship, whether it’s a team member or a customer can go, go to a whole different level.

Paul: Absolutely. And when, when I was overseeing a construction team in Tampa, I would tell them. Find a reason, at least once a week, maybe even more to demonstrate to the customer how you’re doing, they’re doing your [00:34:00] job for them.

And a lot of the construction people would be afraid to send a picture of a broken window or something and admit that there was a mistake in the customer’s home. And I would say, look, I’m going to let you in on a secret here. They don’t think you’re perfect. So you might as well just. Show them what they’re going to see anyone when they show up on the job site.

But what you’re going to find is, as you’re sending them a picture of a tile installed, it’s done wrong or something that you’re addressing, they’re going to have an incredible amount of trust in you. And they’re not going to. Have any concerns than when they show up when the house is done, because they’re going to know that you’ve been in the house every day and you’ve taken care of.

And I think the same thing applies to the salespeople that are listening, that find ways to tell the customer what you’re doing behind the scenes for them. they’re gonna love the communication, and then they’re going to know that you’re taking care of them.

Matt: Yeah, absolutely. Couldn’t agree more awesome.

Okay. Mollie, did I, am I missing anything?

Mollie: You know, [00:35:00] when Paul, when you were just talking, you know, pardon me. And I always like, think this way, but it really is a bigger life lesson than just our, our relationships in business. I mean, it really goes for your relationships in general when you can, Have that ability to, to, take ownership and admit when you’re wrong.

It does build stronger relationships. Cause you’re nobody thinks that anyone. Yeah. Perfect. So I think that as people and in our personal relationships as well, builds trust. So, Yeah, I, I love our topic today. I think all three of your points bias towards action ownership of your role and ability to be wrong.

Every single human being can learn from those three things. So, and apply it to life and to business. So for me, this was very, very valuable

Paul: and I agree Mollie, the willingness to be wrong is certainly a factor in my strong marriage at home.

[00:36:00] Matt: Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. Awesome. All right, Paul. Well, thank you so much for coming on the show today. Really appreciate your time and willingness to chat with everyone. And I know this is a added a ton of value to everyone listening. And, if there is anybody that wanted to reach out to you and chat and learn a little bit more about what you do and what you guys do, what is the best way for them to

Paul: feel free to connect with me on LinkedIn or go to Epcot franchising.com.

Matt: Awesome. Alright, well, thanks Paul so much. And, look forward to having you on again sometime soon. Yeah.


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